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thoughts on 1971 Yankee Dolphin 24?
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going to check out this boat that's at one of the local marinas. https://sites.google.com/site/disc2014/members/disc-classified/boats-for-sale-1/tangoiiforsale6800 never been aboard a yankee dolphin, was wondering if any folks out there have thoughts on their design, any short falls i should consider (i've heard that their engine compartment isn't the best design), or specific areas i should look at carefully on a dolphin. i'm mostly looking for a day sailor (usually 2 of us, but able to single hand) on the upper and middle potomac, with the occasional longer trip out the the Chesapeake, maybe up to a week long? i like the idea of a shoal keel vs. a swing keel. this is the first boat we're looking at on our search, also considering 25' odays, catalinas, and similar class boats. thanks for your input- so much to think about!
Ryan: If I remember that boat correctly (I can't access your link right now), the Dolphin is a very pretty boat, Sparkman and Stephens design. It is however, not a boat that is as comfortable or as good in Chesapeake light airs as some of the more modern designs. If you are not all that concerned about a comfortable, roomy (relatively speaking that is) cabin, then the Dolphin is a nice boat. Also, while the Dolphin was a moderate design for her time, I think she is still pretty heavy. Don't expect to be racing along. And don't be swayed by that "solid" hull claim; just about every boat then and now has a "solid" fiberglass hull. Its only the upper end and racing boats that have cored hulls. And virtually all boats (including the Dolphin) have cored decks. You have to be careful about checking the condition of the deck on older boats; virtually all have had water intrusion issues, and it is necessary to know what you are getting into. Its pretty common now (although by no means standard) for the decks on higher quality boats to have solid decks around deck hardware fittings. This prevents the inevitable water intrusion from affecting the core. However, it was a virtually unknown construction technique back in the day. Subsequent repairs may have created the same protections on an older boat, but only the owner will know for sure. It sounds to me that you have the right list of potential candidates to review. A couple of suggestions: the Odays have a keel/centerboard set up: ballast in a stub keel, with a mostly unweighted centerboard available to increase draft when necessary. The Catalinas have a true swing keel (ballast is all in the swinging keel). I think the Oday design is superior in every way. Having said that, the Catalina cabin on the 25 is better suited to cruising than the Oday (with one notable exception): the Catalina has a pop top to give you standing headroom, and was available with a neat dinette floor plan. Catalina is also still in business, and Catalina Direct still sells direct replacement parts for all of their boats. Oday is long gone. While Oday support is readily available over the internet and from D&R Marine in Mass., its not quite the same. However, Oday clearly as an advantage over Catalina in the placement of the head; its behind a real door in the Oday. The best set up for the C25 has the head behind a folding accordian screen. Never underestimate the value of the head behind a door when sailing with the ladies. Have fun looking, and be sure to post pictures!
mstern- thanks for the reminder about checking for deck fittings and water intrusion. that dern shifty water, always trying to sneak its way into boats! what do you mean when you say 'not as comfortable in light airs"? harder to maneuver/steer because of slower speeds, or the actually comfort of sitting on the boat as it reacts slower to any wave action since you won't be zipping along? for the most part, i do want a boat that performs well (aka not a macgreagor), but am not looking to race or expect to break any speed records (partner is new sailor). mostly something to get out in after work, or to take out for an overnight on some weekends.
When I wrote "not as comfortable or as good in light airs", I meant to highlight two different points: the cabin is uncomfortable (relatively), and the boat is not a great sailer in light air. The very pretty hull shape and profile of the Dolphin is derived from the CCA and wooden workboat-inspired designs that were common at that time. Most builders were still taking wood boat designs, and modestly adapting them to be built in fiberglass. The low freeboard, swooping sheer, small cockpit, and low cabin top look gorgeous, but also have the effect of making the cabin interior small and dark. Because of these very common traits of sailboats of the era, I find their cabins to be relatively less comfortable and roomy below. Tankage and amenities tend to be spartan. No evil intent on the part of the designers or builders, but that was the standard wisdom and consumer expectation of the day. If you are just daysailing, then no worries. The cabin isn't your primary concern. And you may still find that "camping on the water" mindset to fit your goals and interests. However, if you have expectations of more creature comforts while staying on your boat, the more recent designs will fit your plans better. As for sailing ability, the Dolphin is a full keel boat. It has more wetted surface (more drag), and I think weighs more than more modern designs. Generally speaking, full keel designs do not point as high into the wind, nor tack as easily as a fin keel boat. I have never sailed on a Dolphin, but my experience with full keel boats is that they aren't as fast or as manuverable, and they need more wind to get up and go. And because they are heavy and have so much of their body dragging through the water, they just aren't as fast. Oh, and backing up with a full keel boat under power is always an exercise in random movement. It takes a lot of practice to get that manuver to the point where it isn't terrifying. Full keel designs have their plusses: they track straight like they are on rails, they are generally less vulnerable to grounding damage (although the centerboard on Dolphin makes this less of an advantage for that design), and the rudder is better protected. For my money, they just don't sail as well as a fin keeled boat, and that's the bottom line. That all being said, full keel boats to me look so beautiful above the water line that its almost worth it. Almost.
I have not seen one of these boats in many years, but this is a design that I always admired. As noted in the ad, the Yankee Dolphin began life in the 1960's as a MORC (Midget Ocean Racing)rule race boat. They were designed by Sparkman and Stephens at a time when S&S was about as good a designer as you could find. The MORC rule of that era produced designs which were also about as good as they got, at least during that period. Compared to other designs from that era, boats like Dolphin went upwind very well, performed well on a run with the board up, and were good sailing boats pretty much on any point of sail. By intent, these were also surprisingly seaworthy designs for their size. MStern is right that light air performance would not be great. Boats of this era were designed for huge 170-180% genoas and large full sholdered spinnakers. Without these big sails, light air performance is not very good. While light air sailing ability is important on the Chesapeake, and I don't know how you sail, many, if not most daysailors and overnighters, chose not to sail in the lower wind ranges, so this may have minimal effect on you personally. The shortcoming of the rig proportion is that it requires a proper choice of headsails for the conditions. The large headsails needed for the lighter end of the wind range are way over-powered at the high end of the wind range to the point that you can't simply rely on a furler to deal with shortening sail and expect to handle really strong winds. A decent modern design would be expected to offer much better speed, (a PHRF of 265 is approaching the painfully slow category) and better light air performance, but certainly would not get into the shallow water that these boats can slip into. My recollection of these boats is that they had a surprisingly complete interior for a boat of this size and era. While not luxurious as some of the later condo style designs, I seem to recall a very workable layout for the kinds of cruising one might do on the Chesapeake. Over time these boats were built by several companies and build quality and details varied, but my recollection is that these boats were simply but nicely constructed. As noted, one of the big "if's" will the deck coring which depending on the particular company that built the boat (and my memory), was either masonite or plywood, neither of which are particularly good cores from a core rot standpoint. Lunch over, I need to get back to work.... Jeff
A friend had one of these a number of years back. I remember it as a solid boat, decent sailor, with not a lot of space below. The Pearson 26 I had at the time was a palace below compared to the Dolphin. You haven't looked at any boats yet. Look at a few to get an idea of what you like and don't like.
that's the plan- shop around! it just happens that this is the first boat, and is not as common as other makes. figured i'd ask around to get some opinions/experiences about it since there's not a ton of info online (aside from happy dolphin owners!) that isn't a little biased...
Had a dockside look at the Dolphin one time -- loved the general look of the vessel. Dimly recall that the interior was small. (Being 6'2" might have influenced my viewpoint!) As another poster pointed out, you might also consider the Pearson 26. Nice all around pocket cruiser with a good turn of speed. In that range, also look for an Ericson 25. We cruised (and raced occasionally) a Niagara 26 for a happy decade. If you were in the Pacific NW, I would advise finding a Ranger 24, also. Happy hunting!
Very pretty boat to my eye. Looks like a Tartan 27 little sister. Cramped down below, but well designed. As has been said, it's all about the deck. Powered by outboard in a well - no problem to fix. Hull solid glass. I think it's a vey nice little cruiser/day sailor that can handle some ugly weather. Skywalker T27 249
Look at the hull shape in the line drawings: DOLPHIN 24 (S&S) sailboat specifications and details on sailboatdata.com Nearly identical to the Tartan 27', also designed by S&S: TARTAN 27 sailboat specifications and details on sailboatdata.com Tartan 27's smaller sister ship it is and even Jeff_H (resident boat design critic) did not drag it over the coals. Not surprising since Jeff_H also had kind words for the T27 somewhere in the ether here. The Dolphin 24' (if in good shape) or the T27 would both be good choices in my not so humble opinion. I am a bit biased though.
Nice job, Caleb! Skywalker
Well put mstern. I can only add that we raced our full keeled T27 against a fleet of fin keeled boats (T30, C30, O'Day 27 and 25 ...) this season and took 1st place. Sure, our PHRF is higher then most of the other boats and certainly the fin keeled models point higher into the wind but I find all of this to just add to the challenge. The full keeled boat does track like a dream and as such is very forgiving since she can't turn on a dime. This quality also makes the boat a bit more comfortable in choppy water as the hull tends to punch through waves rather then over them. I have grounded our T27 with the center board down and it has never caused a problem as the CB just tucks back up into the slot. I refer to it as our depth sounder since our electronic one does not work so well.
thought this went through yesterday, but i'll try again... got around to looling at the boat and it looked solid- for a 40 year old boat. i guess it's part of the learning process as i look around. the more time i spent on it, the more i could see what is simple grime and what needs actual repair. rigging needs replacement, the running rigging was pretty crusty/sun baked. the big question on my mind is the standing rigging: are those the original wires? could be, since it's spent most of its life on the light winds and fresh water of the potomac river. it was previously a local club boat (i've contacted them trying to get a better sense of maintenance over the years). i'll leave that question to a surveyor, if we come to that point, as that's not something to guess on... the cabin is tiny, as folks have recalled. just the way boats used be be made, i suppose. i could live with it though, as 90% of time on the boat will be day sailing, and i'm used to backpack camping and roughing it. i learned to sail on a 25' drascombe gig in florida, camping under a tarp in the keys for 2 weeks at a time. amazing boat- too bad i couldn't get my hands on one! solid bones, new motor, rigged for single handing.
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- Sailboat Guide
Yankee Dolphin 24
Yankee Dolphin 24 is a 24 ′ 1 ″ / 7.4 m monohull sailboat designed by Sparkman & Stephens and built by Yankee Yachts Inc. starting in 1968.
Rig and Sails
Auxilary power, accomodations, calculations.
The theoretical maximum speed that a displacement hull can move efficiently through the water is determined by it's waterline length and displacement. It may be unable to reach this speed if the boat is underpowered or heavily loaded, though it may exceed this speed given enough power. Read more.
Classic hull speed formula:
Hull Speed = 1.34 x √LWL
Max Speed/Length ratio = 8.26 ÷ Displacement/Length ratio .311 Hull Speed = Max Speed/Length ratio x √LWL
Sail Area / Displacement Ratio
A measure of the power of the sails relative to the weight of the boat. The higher the number, the higher the performance, but the harder the boat will be to handle. This ratio is a "non-dimensional" value that facilitates comparisons between boats of different types and sizes. Read more.
SA/D = SA ÷ (D ÷ 64) 2/3
- SA : Sail area in square feet, derived by adding the mainsail area to 100% of the foretriangle area (the lateral area above the deck between the mast and the forestay).
- D : Displacement in pounds.
Ballast / Displacement Ratio
A measure of the stability of a boat's hull that suggests how well a monohull will stand up to its sails. The ballast displacement ratio indicates how much of the weight of a boat is placed for maximum stability against capsizing and is an indicator of stiffness and resistance to capsize.
Ballast / Displacement * 100
Displacement / Length Ratio
A measure of the weight of the boat relative to it's length at the waterline. The higher a boat’s D/L ratio, the more easily it will carry a load and the more comfortable its motion will be. The lower a boat's ratio is, the less power it takes to drive the boat to its nominal hull speed or beyond. Read more.
D/L = (D ÷ 2240) ÷ (0.01 x LWL)³
- D: Displacement of the boat in pounds.
- LWL: Waterline length in feet
Comfort Ratio
This ratio assess how quickly and abruptly a boat’s hull reacts to waves in a significant seaway, these being the elements of a boat’s motion most likely to cause seasickness. Read more.
Comfort ratio = D ÷ (.65 x (.7 LWL + .3 LOA) x Beam 1.33 )
- D: Displacement of the boat in pounds
- LOA: Length overall in feet
- Beam: Width of boat at the widest point in feet
Capsize Screening Formula
This formula attempts to indicate whether a given boat might be too wide and light to readily right itself after being overturned in extreme conditions. Read more.
CSV = Beam ÷ ³√(D / 64)
From a 1959 S&S design (#1497) to the MORC rule. Similar to the O’Day version. (The earlier hulls for the YANKEE DOLPHIN where molded by O’Day. Yankee eventually used one of these to built its own mold.) This design, with some modifications, was built by a number of builders. A wood predecessor was called the MERMAID 24.
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COMMENTS
Designed to determine if a boat has blue water capability. The CSF compares beam with displacement since excess beam contributes to capsize and heavy displacement reduces capsize vulnerability. The boat is better suited for ocean passages (vs coastal cruising) if the result of the calculation is 2.0 or less. The lower the better.
The Dolphin 24 sailboat was designed by Sparkman & Stephens in 1959 - design #1497. This site is a work in progress for owners of O'Day Dolphins, Yankee Dolphins, Pacific Dolphins, Tripp Dolphins, J.J. Taylor Dolphins, the Mermaid 24, the fin keeled dolphins built in New Zealand - the S&S 24 and the Falcon 24, the Shaw 24, and for all those ...
The full keeled boat does track like a dream and as such is very forgiving since she can't turn on a dime. This quality also makes the boat a bit more comfortable in choppy water as the hull tends to punch through waves rather then over them.
DOLPHIN 24 (YANKEE) has retained its value as a result of superior building, a solid reputation, and a devoted owner base. Read on to find out more about DOLPHIN 24 (YANKEE) and decide if it is a fit for your boating needs.
The Dolphin 24 is an American trailerable sailboat that was designed by William Shaw of Sparkman & Stephens as a Midget Ocean Racing Club (MORC) racer-cruiser and first built in 1959. Shaw had been one of the instigators of the MORC rules. The boat is Sparkman & Stephens' design #1497.
Yankee Dolphin 24 is a 24 ′ 1 ″ / 7.4 m monohull sailboat designed by Sparkman & Stephens and built by Yankee Yachts Inc. starting in 1968.
Classic Yankee Dolphin 24 (hull #219) from the boards of the legendary Sparkman & Stephens, who considered this fun, fast and forgiving pocket cruiser/weekender one of their best designs. Numerous upgrades including Awlgripped hull, Yamaha outboard, dodger, solar panel and standing & running rigging (full list below).
Practicing single-handed boat handling with our "new" Yankee Dolphin 24. Filmed with a GoPro
The Dolphin 24 yankee is a 24.16ft masthead sloop designed by Sparkman & Stephens and built in fiberglass by Yankee Yachts Inc. (USA) since 1968. The Dolphin 24 yankee is a moderate weight sailboat which is a good performer.
This group is for owners of or people interested in the Dolphin 24 sailboats, including Pacific Dolphin, Yankee Dolphin and Oday versions of the boat. It is open to new members and exists to discuss anything related to the boat - like modifications, who has what hull numbers, handling tactics, where to find parts etc.